Former President Donald Trump is in court again, this time in his second trial for defamation of writer E. Jean Carroll. In the first trial, which ended in May 2023, a federal jury found Trump had “sexually abused” her and defamed her when he denied her allegations and ordered him to pay US$5 million in damages. A jury in this trial will determine whether he needs to pay more for additional defamation, and how much.
To understand more about what’s going on in this courtroom, The Conversation U.S. spoke with John E. Jones III, the president of Dickinson College, who is a retired federal judge appointed by President George W. Bush and confirmed unanimously by the U.S. Senate in 2002.
How does a judge handle either lawyers or defendants who don’t know or don’t follow the rules?
Typically in civil cases you wouldn’t see the client acting out. That’s anomalous. Generally, the client adheres to the instructions that the court and their attorney give. One of the worst things any litigant can do when there’s a jury in the box is speaking out loudly – not even a stage whisper but actually speaking out and talking directly to the judge.
Most judges find that pretty intolerable, because when somebody’s represented by counsel, they’re not supposed to be addressing the judge directly – and certainly not making statements that are not under oath that the jury can hear, as is happening in New York.
What you want as the presiding judge is for the trial to unfold in a way that’s fair. You’re on edge all the time as the judge trying to guard the record. When you’ve got a defendant who’s talking back to you, and an attorney who’s not listening, intentionally or otherwise, and blowing through all the guidance that you’re trying to give her, it’s headache-inducing for the judge.
How does the fact that one of the parties in this case is an extremely prominent political candidate play into the judge’s mindset?
I had the occasion to have a couple of elected officials in Pennsylvania in criminal cases in front of me. It’s a curiosity when you first see it, but for a practiced trial judge like Judge Kaplan – I hate to say it this way – but Trump just becomes another difficult litigant.
Kaplan is aware of the fact that it’s the former president of the United States. He can see the Secret Service members in the courtroom, but the fact of the matter is, it’s his domain.
Trump is there as a litigant, not as the former president. All persons stand equally before the law. That’s not an empty phrase. Kaplan has to do his best to make sure that both E. Jean Carroll and Trump get an even shake in court, despite the fact that, frankly, Trump may be annoying the hell out of Kaplan. You just have to go with it.
Former President Donald Trump is in court again, this time in his second trial for defamation of writer E. Jean Carroll. In the first trial, which ended in May 2023, a federal jury found Trump had “sexually abused” her and defamed her when he denied her allegations and ordered him to pay US$5 million in damages. A jury in this trial will determine whether he needs to pay more for additional defamation, and how much.
To understand more about what’s going on in this courtroom, The Conversation U.S. spoke with John E. Jones III, the president of Dickinson College, who is a retired federal judge appointed by President George W. Bush and confirmed unanimously by the U.S. Senate in 2002.
How does a judge handle either lawyers or defendants who don’t know or don’t follow the rules?
Typically in civil cases you wouldn’t see the client acting out. That’s anomalous. Generally, the client adheres to the instructions that the court and their attorney give. One of the worst things any litigant can do when there’s a jury in the box is speaking out loudly – not even a stage whisper but actually speaking out and talking directly to the judge.
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